Robert Kirkman: The (Not) Zombie Guy
Robert Kirkman is one of my favorite comic book writers. He injects the perfect amount of humor, suspense, and emotion into his stories. Maybe that’s why they sell so well. You might have heard of some of his books: The Walking Dead, Invincible, Marvel Zombies…the list goes on. His books are largely accessible if you are trying to get adults into comic books. He brings the best elements of the medium to the table, so when I heard I was getting an interview, I was pretty stoked.
I caught up with Mr. Kirkman on an afternoon where we both had way too much time. We ended up shooting the shit about comics, horror movies, and possible casting for the Invincible movie. Sit back, relax, and enjoy a tour through the life and thoughts of one of our favorite comic book writers.
Gilmore: How’s it going?
Kirkman: Things are going fine.
What have you been up to today?
I’ve been working on comics, stories, and units. I’ve also been watching movie trailers.
Have you seen any good trailers?
No [laughs]. You see, that would just be me revealing that I wasn’t just joking, and I have been watching my fair share of trailers.
What do you think about the Hancock trailer?
I think it looks awesome.
You really think it looks awesome?
Ah, yeah. I really do think it looks awesome. Why? Do you not?
I think it might look a little-
You’re mistaken! [laughs]
I think I might have been turned off by the “Get out the way” song. You know, the song that’s on there. Move! get out the way! Get out the way!…
No. I completely tune that out.
Really?
Yeah, I’m proud of myself for doing so.
Well, that distracted me. Kind of like- What did you think of the Iron man trailer?
Is there a new Iron man trailer? Or is it the one that has already been seen?
It’s the one everybody’s already seen.
Yeah, I’ve seen that one. I just disliked the inclusion of the Iron Man song by Black Sabbath.
Thank you! Those were my thoughts exactly.
It just annoys the piss out of me.
Me too
I think it would have been better if they got rid of the part where they use the vocals of the theme song saying Iron Man for their title sequence.
Or even just the song. It’s just so cheese ball, isn’t it?
The song would be a guitar solo if we took the lyrics out. I think I can live with that. Most people won’t catch it, but GOOD LORD it gets annoying.
It’s really annoying. It just takes over and downs the quality of the trailer.
It really does. But other than that, I’m really excited for the movie. I’m sure it’s going to be great.
Yeah, I’m exactly where you are on that…so you’re a big comic book fan, eh?
[interruption]
Sorry, I had a few guys working on my house.
Oh, nice. What are you getting done?
I’m just getting some new doors on…they’re done now, so that shouldn’t happen again.
Did you kick in the door, or something?
Hmmm…yeah, I have a pretty bad temper. (Laughs)
Sounds good…Wolf-manning it up?
Yeah, it’s pretty rough.
So, I heard something on the internet, but I couldn’t confirm it. Did you really name your son Peter Parker Kirkman?
Yes I did.
That’s awesome. So, what made you decide to do that?
Well, I’m a gigantic comic book nerd. Also, naming things is not very easy.
And Parker is his middle name, so I don’t think people are going to make the connection.
Yeah, So Peter Kirkman works.
Yeah, it’s fine.
So, Spider-Man? Was that your guy? Was that your character growing up?
Yeah, definitely. I mean much more so than Batman, or Superman, or whatever. I mean, Spider-man was the coolest one of the bunch, right?
Totally
Yeah, and he also has the best costume in comics.
Hmmm, best costume in comics?…
Yeah, He has the flashiest and most unique costume. Superman and Batman are just wearing underwear.
…And capes. You’re not a fan of capes are you?
I don’t really mind capes. I don’t really have a preference either way. I just think it depends on the design. I don’t think Batman would necessarily work without a cape. It’s just odd that the Marvel Universe is largely sans-cape, you know?
Definitely. I was just saying that because Invincible doesn’t have a cape.
No, no he doesn’t. You would have to talk with Corey [Walker] about that. I didn’t design that guy.
Oh really?
No, no. no. no. no. That’s why I co-created it.
Aaah, nice. I want to back track a little: as a creator, what are some of your favorite comics growing up? A lot of people throw out Miller’s Daredevil, Watchmen, and Dark Knight Returns, but do you have any inspirations that we might not have heard of?
Well actually I didn’t read Dark Knight or Watchmen until pretty late in my life. I think [I read it] when I was in high school. I didn’t know anything about that shit. I really liked the run on Spider-Man with MacFarlane and Larson. I think those were the first comics I read. I actually picked them up when Larson had recently taken over and back tracked to the atomic frontal issues. I am a fairly young dude, so I didn’t read comics very much in the…well…I didn’t read comics at all in the 80’s. So I started when I was about 13-14, in 1990, so my taste runs a little different than most people’s, I guess.
When Image started up I just kind of dove over there, pretty exclusively. I was a big fan of Young Blood, Shadow Hawk, and Savage Dragon; which is one of my favorite comic to this day. That was a pretty big influence on my work.
Savage Dragon is pretty much the best superhero you know, because it was all done by one guy, and there’s all kinds of unique and interesting stuff that happens and there’s real change. It’s kind of like – I don’t want to say a superhero comic for adults – but it’s definitely not your run on the mill “lets rotate the villains in and out” kind of superhero book; which 99% of comic books are. As far as interpersonal relationships and stuff like that, you can’t do any better than Minimum Wage, by Bob Fingerum. I was a really big fan of that book when I was in high school.
So, what are you currently reading? Give me your top three current titles.
Top three current titles…
Yeah, sorry for putting you on the spot there.
I really like the Umbrella Academy. I think that that book is remarkably well put together. And for a guy who has never written a comic before, that Rockstar guy, Gerald Lee [the guy from My Chemical Romance]. That book was really entertaining, it’s really good. I really like Jack Staff.
All-Star Superman is really good.
Oh, All-Star Superman is great.
Yeah. I feel like I’m learning when I’m reading that book; it’s kind of cool. It’s like “Ah, so that’s how that’s done.” “Oh, that is a very unique way of portraying that”.
So that’s kind of fun. I don’t know if I’m actually learning. It might not be improving my game at all, but I like to think that you learn a few tricks when you read that book.
Have you ever thought of writing a book like that? Where all the issues and stories are self-contained?
I try to do that every now-and-then in Invincible. I think I’m going to try to do that more and more as things go on. I mean, for the most part, every issue of Invincible is somewhat self-contained. There are very few where there’s a clear arc or where they’re fighting the same bad guy for six issues.
I mean, I do think that comics can stand to have a few more series out there that are pretty self-contained every month. So, I would like to do a series that is exclusively that but, I doubt it would be as good as All-Star Superman.
I think it could be. I mean, currently Invincible, not to rub my nose or anything-
I’m not going to denounce it. That book rocks.
Dude, Invincible rocks. It’s my favorite superhero comic right now.
That was going to be my number three choice but I thought it would sound too…
You should’ve squeezed it in there.
I really like New Avengers too. I don’t really think that it reads like an Avengers book, but more like a “here’s what’s going on today in the Marvel Universe today” book, which I think is a lot of fun. And I like the arc quite a bit.
It’s totally great. So, I want to ask you about-
And Ex Machina is really good. Every time you start to ask me a question, I think of this other book, which I probably should mention [laughs]
Ok. Keep doing that and I’ll ask the questions. You can squeeze in books, then we’ll talk about them and then I’ll ask more questions [both laugh]
I wanted to ask about the run-in you had with Todd MacFarlane in San Diego a little while ago. I remember you gave him some shit for no longer writing comic books. I mean, did you mean that with malice, or was it kind of an open thumb?
I really didn’t mean to come off like I was giving him shit, per say. I was trying to be funny and entertaining. I didn’t stand up to yell at the guy. I wanted it to be like a plea from a fan for him to do more in the comics field. A lot of people tell me “Oh, you really stuck it to him”, and I don’t really think I did. There is a video on YouTube; you can watch it if you want.
They also say that I was asking him to draw a comic, which I clearly wasn’t. I know that Todd may have moved on with his life and that he might never draw another comic – and that’s fine. I mean, at the end of the day, if his family is fed and has shelter over their heads, I think that’s what you really need to worry about. He doesn’t owe us anything. And some people turn it into that. What I was basically asking was: why doesn’t he participate in the creation of comics at all? He’s very hands on with his toys and also does designs for them. He seems to care about the toys, the toys have the Atomic imprint, and to a certain extent, I don’t see him doing anymore comics. I mean, he’s still kind of hands on with Spawn, but I was like “It’s been this long, and you’re still doing Spawn? Why don’t you make some new comics?” I mean, he doesn’t have to write, he doesn’t have to draw. Just throw some Todd MacFarlane ideas out there, I’m sure you have some, and do another comic. And I guess that resulted in him asking me to help him do that.
I remember that. Did you ever convince him to do anything with you? What happened with all that?
Well, that’s all happening right now buddy.
Really?
Yeah. He contacted me shortly after the convention (well, one of his people contacted me). I had a few conversations with him and we bounced some ideas back and forth and came up with one that we liked and we developed it a few months before San Diego and we’ve been working on it ever since.
There might be a book signing in 2008. He’s doing all the character designs. We’ve even been co-creating all the characters together and he’s going to draw all the covers while I write the book. We’ve also got another artist to draw the book, but we haven’t announced who that is yet. It’s supposed to be due this summer.
That is awesome. What it’s about? What it’s called?
It’s called Haunt. It’s kind of a ghost-themed superhero book. It’s about two estranged brothers; one dies over the course of the first issue and together the two brothers form a superhero. It’s a live brother and a ghost brother, and they team up to fight crime. It has a bit of a horror slant to it, but it’s very much a superhero book.
You write a lot of horror themed books.
Well, the Walking Dead was popular, so I figured that I should stick with that one thing [laughs].
Do you want to be known as a horror writer?
No, I really don’t. I don’t want to be known as anything. I actually got spotted in Best Buy yesterday and the guy [who spotted me] said, “Hey, it’s the zombie guy!”
[both laugh]
…And I began to cry. I mean it’s really just coincidence. I do Walking Dead, which is a horror book, and then I do The Astounding Wolfman, which is a werewolf superhero book.
And you also did Marvel Zombies.
…Ok you’re right, it’s all horror and zombies.
[Laughs] I mean, were you a big horror fan growing up? You have to have been a big horror movie fan.
I am now. I don’t really know if I was while I was growing up. I wasn’t really allowed to watch them until I was like about…too old to enjoy them [laughs]. If you don’t watch the Friday the 13th movies before you’re 13, you’ll realize that they kind of suck; while if you see them at a young age you’ll think, “Oh my god! This is so coolest thing ever!”
My son will be watching them at age 8.
So, I didn’t get into watching those until I was 15. I was allowed to watch Hellraiser every Halloween. When I was younger, I would go out and rent Hellraiser one and two, so that was the only time I felt that I was able to watch an “R” rated movie.
Why Hellraiser?
I don’t know. I like the guy with the pins in his head. It looked cool in the box. It was back when kids mostly rented videos at the video store based on the cover; it wasn’t like we were watching trailers. The only way I would find out about a movie would be that little gray picture in the news paper. I remember dying to see Robocop when I was little just because of that picture of the big robot guy getting out of a police car. That movie was not very underage appropriate at all…
Robocop was awesome.
Robocop was awesome, and I did see it at a pretty early age, so it terrified me.
Really? Wow.
No, well, it terrified me like “Whoa! This is totally great!”…
I remember whenever they took off his helmet, for some reason, it freaked me out. I think it’s because his hairline went up so high.
Also because his head looked like a giant penis.
Yeah! That was fucked up. That was weird looking. I didn’t like that. I also remember walking through the video store, and the one movie that scared the shit out of me was Childs Play.
I watched that. I watched a few of those movies (don’t mean to sound so sheltered). But yeah I did. I thought it was cool…It really wasn’t. I was watching it again recently and it’s not the best movie.
Yeah, not at all. Did any of these movies scare you? Does any horror movie actually scare you right now?
The Six Sense Scared the shit out of me when it first came out. It was ridiculous. I am a bit terrified of ghosts – I don’t know why. Movies with monsters in them usually don’t scare me because – well, they’re fairly unrealistic. But the ghost stories that you hear during Halloween like: “The guy who built this house and later died in it in 1774 will be walking next to your bed tonight”. I don’t want that to happen.
So, I’m basically a sissy with this kind of stuff. My wife loves watching those Halloween themed ghost shows where it’s like, “Oh my god! This house is haunted by this ghost!”, and they have to play this creepy music. The crazy reenactments, which are usually hilarious, are almost too unsettling for me.
Really? Wow. So like Mythbusters…Ghostbusters?
Yeah, like that stuff. But you know, my mom claims that she lived in a haunted house when she was younger and she has stories about ghosts chasing people around the house and stuff. Not to say I believe in ghosts. I’ve never seen that shit.
So you might believe in ghosts…
I believe in ghosts as much as I believe in Santa Claus. I’ve never seen him, who knows?
…So, you write Walking Dead and all of these other horror books; do you ever try make them scary?
I had people tell me that the books are scary, but I don’t really see how. I know people write horror novels all the time, and I think those are scary. But I think it relies on the person’s picture in their head of what they’re seeing, which is always scarier than what they put in the movies and stuff. And also, the sense of mood and eeriness, which I guess goes more with a novel.
So, with the comic it’s all there on the page and it’s all in drawing and there’s no motion and no sound to go along with it. So, comics in general are kind of a weak medium to do horror in. I think I said that on an interview before and Steve [Niles – creator of 30 Days of Night] got all pissed off.
I agree, don’t worry [because that makes it all better?…]
I’m not saying that his book isn’t scary. He’s a nice guy. His books are very good, very entertaining, they’re very…you know.
I don’t think people read a horror comic and can’t go to bed that night. The Walking Dead is supposed to tell an entertaining story. It’s not to really supposed to scare.
I think the book is not about zombies popping out and killing people, but more about how the people would naturally react in that situation. Maybe the reason people say it’s scary is because all the characters in it are just so realistic and everything that happens could theoretically happen in that situation. So maybe it puts them so realistically in that world that it scares them.
Yeah I guess a certain investment with the characters kind of makes you fear for their lives, I can see that. Thanks!
You’re welcome. So you write a lot of zombie stuff. Big zombie fan?
I’ve written two zombie books, jerk.
[laughs] Just kidding…The guy at Best Buy did say you’re the zombie guy, though.
I’m not the zombie guy. I’m not the zombie guy…[talking to himself] I’m not the zombie guy [mantra]…
[laughs]
My two most popular projects have been zombie books [long sigh]. I really do love zombies, though. I’m a big, big fan of the Romero films from way back. I could watch them right now. I’ve seen them a billion times and they hold up. They’re vastly entertaining.
As a subgenre of horror I think zombie movies are pretty kick ass. So, when I was putting together another creator-owned book for Image I just kind of hit on the idea of doing the zombie movie that never ends.
Do you have a favorite Romero movie?
I prefer Day of the Dead
Day of the Dead? Huh, that’s interesting.
The last one, yeah. I think it has the best zombies. It’s got a really good setting, and it’s got a lot of good scenes. I don’t know, I mean they’re all fantastic.
Definitely
You know Night of the Living Dead is the classic. It’s probably got the most poignant ending. It’s a really well put together movie, I think it’s better than Dawn of the Dead. Dawn of the Dead is awesome, but the zombies look like they’re made of toothpaste. It’s fun to think about “What would I do if I had free run of the mall?” So that’s a really good movie, but I think Day of the Dead is the best one.
How’d you feel about Land of the Dead?
I liked it.
Really?
I liked it a whole hell of lot. I really dug it. I didn’t like the spinal cord zombie.
The spinal cord zombie?
It’s like “I’m walking around and my head is dangling on my back…”
[laughs]
…and then he like whips his head all around?
Yeah
…and attacks the main guy! It’s near the end when they’re getting in the car. That looked a little fake to me
Yeah, that would never happen!
I think it’s a good movie. I think it holds up next to the other ones. I don’t know.
Meh
I guess a lot of people didn’t like it, I know you didn’t like it.
Oh I didn’t like the smart zombie. I didn’t like the smart leader zombie. I always think those types of characters – the smart leader monsters that exist even though every single other one is really dumb. I think they’re a cop out.
My only problem with him was that he looked more like a monster and less like a zombie.
Yeah
But I can forgive that. He had established with Bub in Day of the Dead that the zombies were evolving. So this is just continuation of that so I didn’t really have a problem with it. that’s the thing that makes the Romero films as a series unique is that you know he came up with the thing of evolving zombies and you know.
Good point
Civilization reforming and stuff like that, I mean that’s kind of cool.
Yeah
If you look at it as a series it’s kind of like a neat progression. You know, if that zombie was Bub it would have been a little cooler – but, you know, whatever.
Will your zombies ever evolve?
No.
Cool
I have cribbed enough from Romero
[laughs]
But who knows, I may change my mind in twenty issues you never know. There are no plans for it right now. They are what they are and you know the books aren’t really about the zombies, so I don’t see doing a plot point that kind of centers around them like that. I don’t really see any benefit in it.
Alright that makes sense. I know you’ve been asked this a million times. But you know I guess as of now maybe…
You going to ask me about the ending or something?
Nah, I just maybe you’ve changed your mind about…
The origin?
Yeah.
[Kirkman laughs]
Come on!
It’s so much easier just to not have an origin.
[laughs]
Well, I mean, to a certain extent The Walking Dead is a very realistic book. Like you said: in the situation the things that happen to those people are all very realistic. Even the governor coming back and being alive. That could totally happen.
Riiight
So you’ve got that realism to the book and I think that’s what makes people respond to it like they do. Aside from the fact that zombies are running around, pretty much everything that happens in the book could really happen to these people. It gives them a relatable aspect. Explaining where the zombies came from leaves you with less options. You have to then push the book more into the vain of sci-fi. I think it’s going to hinder the realism of the book. That’s why I don’t think I’ll ever explain an origin. But who knows, maybe when the sales start plummeting…
[both laugh]
Walking Dead Origins issue one, you know?
Yeah.
I have no integrity,
[laughs] So why the hell not, right?
Yeah, but as it is right now, you know, on my high horse, I don’t see the need.
[laughs] Nice. So I wanted to switch gears over to Invincible. I love Invincible. We talk about it non-stop on our podcast. I even get crap for how much I talk about it.
Well I don’t think you’re mentioning it often enough.
[laughs] We recommend it to a lot of first-time comics readers. It has a lot of throwbacks to classics, too – for example: that like monstery Rorschach character.
Yeah, yeah that guy.
Was that your idea?
Yes of course.
Just wondering. You never know, Ottley or someone could have just thrown it in.
Oh no no no, no. Ottley has no ideas.
[laughs] Oh hey! Speaking of the art. I‘ve had an ongoing debate with my friend Ben. Is Invincible supposed to be Asian?
No…I think the answer is that when we started working on Invincible, Cory did not want to have to draw strands of hair. So everyone’s hair is just filled in black [SUCK IT, BEN!]
Heh that’s funny I didn’t notice that, I mean that makes sense. Um but it’s just he looks.
No it really doesn’t, but that’s how that happens
[laughs] So, he’s not intentionally Asian good to know. Cause it looks like….
No, no I actually hate Asian people as a rule.
Oooh ok. All right, good to know. So I mean I’ll make sure to print that and that’ll be the title.
[both laugh]
That’ll be the little byline under your name.
Yeah you’ll cut that out, right?
Uh yeah, oh yeah, we’ll cut that out,
Ugghh!
You’re about to get a bunch of shit from the Asian community.
Ok fine, I…. I’m kidding. He’s Asian.[laughs]
[note: this section was completely facetious and neither of us is racist. Except for Kirkman; who hates Asians.]
So I’ve heard you might be doing an Invincible film, is that true?
Might be. I’m not. Paramount has optioned the film.
So it’s still very pipeline, eh? Did they approach you to write it?
Yes, I have written two drafts of the screenplay. It all started in 2000…doesn’t feel like it’ll ever get made. The status of it is that it is currently just kind of sitting there. I
So, doo you have a maybe like a dream director or actor that would either direct or act in the movie?
Director or actor…for Mark I think Nicolas Cage and for the direction I think Uwe Boll. What do you think? Would that be good for me?
[laughs] think that sounds like the best film I’ve ever, I would ever see.
I think that you know, I don’t know. Whatever, Chris O’neal for uh Omni-Man. Anyone want that? I don’t know, Will Smith for Debbie. I like Will Smith.
Uh yeah that’s good just… just have Invincible be Will Smith I think.
That would be pretty awesome. And then have Will Smith also play his father. Make it like an Eddie Murphy movie.
There we go
Will Smith could also be Debbie. That’d be great.
Why don’t you… you know, why don’t you just cut out the middle man and just make it Eddie Murphy? Everyone is Eddie Murphy.
[laughs] Wow! You know you’re not getting any credit for this.
[laughs] Shit!
It’s going to be the best movie ever made and I am never going to admit that it was your idea.
Fuck. I always get fucked like that…um so…
You want a real answer or can we move on?
Real answer.
[laughs] George Clooney for Omni-Man…and I don’t know there’s some kid out there that would be a good Invincible.
So an unknown?
I like that Michael Cera guy, but I don’t know if he could pull it off. He does kind of have a bit of an Invincible demeanor about him.
Yeah I could see that.
There was a day I would have said Frankie Muniz, but that guy’s probably like 75 years old now. So…
He kind of looks like a fetus, like a walking fetus. He’s really weird looking.
[From there, we go into a thing where Kirkman starts asking ME questions. He learns a lot about my life and we make fun of Eddie Murphy some more…if anyone cares at all, you can just ask me for the full transcript. Send me an email: gilmore@geekscape.net]
Alright who would win in a fight: a Viltrumite or a Kryptonian?
Oh a Viltrumite by far.
Why?
Well first of all a Kryptonian’s really only going to have powers in a certain area of space right?
Right.
So it’d have to take place on earth. And you know, I don’t know how their powers fade, but a Viltrumite could pretty much just pick ‘em up and take them wherever and kill them. Also, if it’s a certain Kryptonian, they’re going to have the disadvantage. A Viltrumite is generally going to be able to do anything and everything to win where as Superman’s a bit of a pussy…I created Viltrumites so I have a preference.
So you could even add something that’s…
Sure, yeah and like during that fight they could be like “and we have Kryptonite hands””Holy fuck!”…Superman’s got the heat vision, though. Viltrumites don’t have that. I don’t know that the Viltrumites have ever done that blowing air thing that Superman does. So I mean [Superman has] certain abilities that they don’t have. So, I don’t know. Who knows? We’ll wait till Invincible meets Superman or whatever comes out and see… see how that works out.
I’ll be waitin’. So do you have anything else coming soon?
I’ve got another series at Image called Brit that continues from some Brit one-shots I did in… 2003? Those were recently collected into a trade paperback. Then I’ve got a new guy named Bruce Brown writing a series based on that character. So I think the fourth issue will be out very soon. So, that’s going on too.
That sounds great and we’ll look forward to your work. We’ll get it and read all of it like everyone already is.
Everyone is already reading it? Why am I doing this interview if everyone is already reading it? What a waste of my time.
I mean that nobody is reading it and you need this interview for publicity for someone to finally start reading.
[laughs] Exactly. Good job.
It was great meeting you.
Good, good chatting. It was a lot of fun. I hope it wasn’t too terrible.
It was awesome.
Initial transcription by Richard Lucas and Ashton Lauren. Thanks so much for your help, guys.
For an inquiries about interviews please contact Brian Gilmore: gilmore@geekscape.net
